4k monitor question

Discussion in 'Microsoft Surface Pro 3' started by thefollans, Oct 7, 2014.

  1. thefollans

    thefollans Member

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    Hey all,So I read all the posts about connecting the SP# to a 4k monitor and was still somewhat confused... a few said you can't run it, a few said you can...Anyway, Dell had a sale on so I bought the Dell 24'' 4k monitor and have hooked it up via a mini-DP to mini-DP cable (without using the dock) and the screen works fine. I get the 3840x2160 resolution at 30mhz.My question is though, everything looks... big. Well, not as small as I thought it would anyway. Like the icons and open windows on the SP3 screen (running at 2160x1440) look smaller than on the 4k screen even though it has a lower resolution. Am I missing something? By running a higher resolution shouldn't I get more screen real estate?Do I need the dock to get this?
    Do I need a mini-DP to DP cable? Does this make a difference?Can anyone explain this to me? :)THANKS!
     
  2. Tosko

    Tosko Member

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    No there is this option in the control panel. What Windows does is it check what screens are connected and magnify it when it thinks its necessary. But that doesn't always turn out too well..

    Play around with those settings. See attachment.

    2014-10-08_0254.png
     
  3. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes Well-Known Member

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    Windows looks at the resolution and screen size. From there it adjust the DPI of Windows.
    High DPI allows you to enjoy smoother text, richer and nicer looking icons, more details can be convey to you. You can also view larger pictures which your cameras take without scroll bars (or reduce), again allowing you to view more details.

    It is exactly like your smart phone. High resolution on a small display, makes text easier to read, and everything is nicer looking.

    Now, while all this is nice and neat, there is a small problem. You see Modern UI apps in Windows 8, the entire infrastructure, was made to allow all software to be high-DPI aware, and have the ability to change DPI on the fly. Sadly, desktop applications dates back from an area of when the concept 'high-DPI' didn't exists. The idea of driving super high resolution (compared at the time), normal to us now, on a small display, was just not taught about. Therefore, desktop application shell infrastructure that Windows desktop application uses, aren't high-DPI aware.

    Microsoft can't change that, because it will break compatibility, and everyone will complain how few or no current software works with the new Windows. But that doesn't mean that Microsoft isn't trying.
    Since XP, Microsoft has implement and improved on every version of Windows DPI scaling on desktop applications. Developers has tools to make their applications on the desktop high-DPI aware.

    The problem, is that the great majority of software on the desktop, aren't high DPI aware. It has to do with priority. Only a small percentage of users uses high-DPI aware application. How many people have Surface Pro's, laptops with a high-resolutions display, and how many have a 4K 24inch screen? Not many. And sadly, for us, it isn't a few lines of code to add. For some programs it is a mater of changing the entire GUI framework that they built, or worst, some are dependent on GUI framework that don't support high-DPI aware. So, it is a lot of work, to provide support.
    Also, many developers don't see it as a selling point. Meaning they don't see that spending huge amount of hours forming potentially months of work, to make their software high-DPI aware, will its make consumer go "Oh! Nice! I need to buy the new version for this feature". So, they just way until it becomes one, or the market share shows that it is a necessity for their software to support.

    Desktop program that aren't high-DPI aware, Windows can only do one things: Scale it big like an image. So the result, is that the application turns blurry.

    Another problem, is that desktop applications don't support dynamic high-DPI scaling. Meaning, if you change the DPI, Windows will EMULATE the DPI by scaling or shrinking things, making even a high-DPI aware application blurry. But you really need to restart your system to apply the settings properly. A note: I believe Microsoft added something under Windows 8.x to allow software to support dynamic scaling, but I am not sure.

    So in your case:
    -> Restart your system, and less things will be blurry
    -> Expect that Windows and Microsoft software (like Office, Visual Studio, etc.) to be high DPI aware in their latest version, but the rest, not to much, and be blurry. Heck, even Device Manager in Windows is not high-DPI aware. Hopefully that will be changed in Windows 10.

    To not have Windows scale things large (ie: increase the DPI of Windows, and leaving it as default), check your Display setting panel in Windows, as Tosko pointed out.
     
  4. thefollans

    thefollans Member

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    Great info thanks guys...

    The one thing I got lost one was why I need to restart my system so less things are blurry?Nothing was blurry, in fact the screen is incredibly sharp. I just thought everything looked big :)I have adjusted the slider as shown in the screen shot and it has made it better... of course, at first, I went to far and everything was tiny... but I have found a happy medium :)
     
  5. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes Well-Known Member

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    That is probably because you have the DPI already set on your Surface Pro. If you move the slider bar, then you need to restart (well sign out and back in, technically). And Windows DOES tell you this, next to the apply button, once you slide the bar.
     
  6. mtalinm

    mtalinm Active Member

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    I got the following to work without any tweaking. here is the setup:

    Surface Pro 3 in dock.
    Dock mini DP into LG 34" curved ultrawide DP.
    SP3 mini DP into Dell U2414H 24" HDMI.

    Did not have to fiddle with any settings. But, was unable to daisy-chain from the U2414H to the LG (had it set up that way with the monitor it replaced).
     
  7. GoodBytes

    GoodBytes Well-Known Member

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    Ah you have the LG ultra wide screen monitor.
    Just a heads up. DO NOT install the included software at all costs. The program is poorly programmed, instead of doing things right, it does it wrong, and screws Windows files and registry to break UAC security systems, opening doors to malware and virus attacks.
    LG said that "they are looking into it", but it's been about a month, and no news.
    http://www.engadget.com/2015/04/09/lg-screen-software-may-be-malware-risk/
     
  8. mtalinm

    mtalinm Active Member

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    thanks for the tip. did not need any of their drivers. SP3 was a champ.

    only regret is that I can't daisy-chain it from another monitor, but no biggie
     
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  9. JBStar

    JBStar New Member

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    I heartily second this advice. I did install the LG software and it was a nightmare. I ended it by doing a System Restore, and then just connecting the LG screen and letting Windows 8.1 "do its thing". Unless it's a PDF, don't install anything from the LG disks!
     

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