I just realized MS lied to us all!

[mtalinm]

I think the media's general reaction to Surface will end up paralleling its reaction to phablets, which many ridiculed but now admit are great.

 

[goodintentions]

I think the media's general reaction to Surface will end up paralleling its reaction to phablets, which many ridiculed but now admit are great.

Well, I stopped taking tech articles seriously a long time ago when I realized those behind the articles really don't know anything. Think about it. They're not ordinary people because they report on this stuff. At the same time, they're not real professionals either, like engineers and businessmen.

So, what they are left with are their personal biases. And most of these biases are geared toward apple. It's really no secret that anything apple is good in their eyes.

Case in point. Drive space expansion slots and USB. When the iPad came out, there were many many articles written on this supposed paradigm shift away from expansion drives and USB connection. It's been how many years and I'll burn down my house before I give up my USB slots. Or how about bigger smartphones? They were ridiculing the galaxy note when it first came out. And now that apple has it's own big phone, all of the sudden it is the greatest apple innovation ever.

I read and watch reviews on these devices mainly to get their specs and how they work. I ignore everything else like their opinion on what's better. We all know they always side with anything that has an apple logo on it.

 

[lhauser]

I always say that the biggest difference between the SP3 and most of the rest of the market is that the SP3 is a Tablet PC. And MS has been working in this concept for more than 15 years. They went from TabletPC to Ultramobilepc and now to "Tablet".

I think MSFT owes a lot to Apple. The concept of the tablet was there, but the iPad created the market and the form factor. That's not to say Microsoft wouldn't have hit on it eventually, and heaven knows they are late to the market (so what else is new), but the iPad gave the tablet form factor legitimacy and gave everyone else a kick to wake them up,

 

[zhenya]

Well, I stopped taking tech articles seriously a long time ago when I realized those behind the articles really don't know anything. Think about it. They're not ordinary people because they report on this stuff. At the same time, they're not real professionals either, like engineers and businessmen.

So, what they are left with are their personal biases. And most of these biases are geared toward apple. It's really no secret that anything apple is good in their eyes.

Case in point. Drive space expansion slots and USB. When the iPad came out, there were many many articles written on this supposed paradigm shift away from expansion drives and USB connection. It's been how many years and I'll burn down my house before I give up my USB slots. Or how about bigger smartphones? They were ridiculing the galaxy note when it first came out. And now that apple has it's own big phone, all of the sudden it is the greatest apple innovation ever.

I read and watch reviews on these devices mainly to get their specs and how they work. I ignore everything else like their opinion on what's better. We all know they always side with anything that has an apple logo on it.

Honestly it appears to me that your own biases are tilting what you are reading. Yes, many tech sites are somewhat biased towards Apple. However it is far from all of them, and the good reviewers are able to write their articles in such a way that if you read carefully, you can get a very good sense of what the positives and negatives of a device are. Reading between the lines is nothing new, and you need to do it in all genres, not just tech.

Journalists aren't supposed to be engineers or businessmen because the vast majority of those professionals are terrible communicators. The best tech writers are drawn from the smaller subset of people who both have an in-depth understanding of tech as well as language. Those are the people to search out, while always being on the lookout for any biases that might creep in. But it's not so bad a situation that none of their content is worth reading. Far worse is to rely on 'reviews' from people on sites like this one where most people have a very narrow range of experiences, have their own money tied up in the product which also leads to heavy confirmation bias, and generally don't have the ability or willingness to place their personal experiences in the larger context of what other people need.

Case in point is your position on USB. If the iPad had stuck with USB ports, the entire tablet market might have tanked like every attempt before it. It has been far too thin for several generations now to incorporate one without a dongle (which they do make) and the entire experience is designed around being consistently reliable. A task that it still sets the bar at. Personal computers required compromises over mainframes. Laptops require compromises over workstations. iPads have compromises over fully optioned tablets. Yet each of those devices exists because they do certain tasks far better than any other.

 

[goodintentions]

Honestly it appears to me that your own biases are tilting what you are reading. Yes, many tech sites are somewhat biased towards Apple. However it is far from all of them, and the good reviewers are able to write their articles in such a way that if you read carefully, you can get a very good sense of what the positives and negatives of a device are. Reading between the lines is nothing new, and you need to do it in all genres, not just tech.

I beg to differ.

For instance, when the iPad came out, nobody in the world complained of the fact that it couldn't run mac OS apps. But when winrt came out, every tech review site cried bloody murder that winrt couldn't run x86 apps.

Journalists aren't supposed to be engineers or businessmen because the vast majority of those professionals are terrible communicators. The best tech writers are drawn from the smaller subset of people who both have an in-depth understanding of tech as well as language. Those are the people to search out, while always being on the lookout for any biases that might creep in. But it's not so bad a situation that none of their content is worth reading. Far worse is to rely on 'reviews' from people on sites like this one where most people have a very narrow range of experiences, have their own money tied up in the product which also leads to heavy confirmation bias, and generally don't have the ability or willingness to place their personal experiences in the larger context of what other people need.

Again, tech writers are limited to their experiences with sitting comfortably at their desk and using MS word. In my short life, I've been a programmer, cop, business owner, and engineer. If that's not real life experience, I don't know what is.

Case in point is your position on USB. If the iPad had stuck with USB ports, the entire tablet market might have tanked like every attempt before it. It has been far too thin for several generations now to incorporate one without a dongle (which they do make) and the entire experience is designed around being consistently reliable. A task that it still sets the bar at. Personal computers required compromises over mainframes. Laptops require compromises over workstations. iPads have compromises over fully optioned tablets. Yet each of those devices exists because they do certain tasks far better than any other.

I wasn't saying that the iPad not having a USB port is a bad thing. I was saying that when the iPad came out every tech writer out there predicted this paradigm shift away from the USB and that because of cloud services the USB would be dead in a couple years.

So, if you love a tablet that doesn't have a USB or sdcard expansion, god bless you for it. What I'm criticizing is the fact that tech writers tried to convince me that I didn't need USB or sdcard expansion slots anymore. I've been a programmer, cop, business owner, and engineer. I can tell you that in real life professional computing, the USB is still a must. Otherwise, your device is just a toy.

One of the companies I worked in the past got everyone an iPad. This was a cool thing for a little while. But over time, these iPad pretty much became expensive email machines. Everyone I've talked to have shared the same observation.

This might be a surprise to most people, but us engineers don't spend all of our time sitting comfortably at our desk with WiFi readily available. The last guy I know who tried to use his iPad in the field quickly ditched it and got something else (android) with a USB port after I asked him to give me his files while we were inspecting and certifying a contractor's work. That same guy ditched his android and got a windows 8 tablet.

Remember, these are still suppose to be tools that we use, not whatever apple tells us they are. If a hammer can't hammer a nail anymore, it's not really a tool anymore is it?

 

[zhenya]

I beg to differ.

For instance, when the iPad came out, nobody in the world complained of the fact that it couldn't run mac OS apps. But when winrt came out, every tech review site cried bloody murder that winrt couldn't run x86 apps.

Because Microsoft hadn't done any preparation to make their App store a viable alternative. Now the same might have been largely true of the original iPad app store, but there was no competition at the time, and Apple aggressively pushed developers to build real tablet apps. RT failed because Microsoft didn't, and the majority of users were right when they said they needed x86 for compatibility. There was nothing they could do on RT short of web browsing, email, and limited office work.

Again, tech writers are limited to their experiences with sitting comfortably at their desk and using MS word. In my short life, I've been a programmer, cop, business owner, and engineer. If that's not real life experience, I don't know what is.

I wasn't saying that the iPad not having a USB port is a bad thing. I was saying that when the iPad came out every tech writer out there predicted this paradigm shift away from the USB and that because of cloud services the USB would be dead in a couple years.

So, if you love a tablet that doesn't have a USB or sdcard expansion, god bless you for it. What I'm criticizing is the fact that tech writers tried to convince me that I didn't need USB or sdcard expansion slots anymore. I've been a programmer, cop, business owner, and engineer. I can tell you that in real life professional computing, the USB is still a must. Otherwise, your device is just a toy.

One of the companies I worked in the past got everyone an iPad. This was a cool thing for a little while. But over time, these iPad pretty much became expensive email machines. Everyone I've talked to have shared the same observation.

This might be a surprise to most people, but us engineers don't spend all of our time sitting comfortably at our desk with WiFi readily available. The last guy I know who tried to use his iPad in the field quickly ditched it and got something else (android) with a USB port after I asked him to give me his files while we were inspecting and certifying a contractor's work. That same guy ditched his android and got a windows 8 tablet.

Remember, these are still suppose to be tools that we use, not whatever apple tells us they are. If a hammer can't hammer a nail anymore, it's not really a tool anymore is it?

As an engineer who spends a great deal of his time in the field on client sites, it drives me mad to hear people constantly referring to the iPad as a toy because it doesn't fit their extremely narrow spectrum of needs (shaped by years of using a certain type of device). The iPad can be a toy. It can also be a fabulous appliance for reading, reference, music and casual use. It can also be a tool - one used heavily by artists, musicians, doctors, real estate agents, small businesses, etc. etc. There is far more to life than office, programming tools and CAD. If you see a device like the iPad as limited, that is shaped by your own narrow viewpoint, not by the power of the device.

 

[Nuspieds]

I read and watch reviews on these devices mainly to get their specs and how they work. I ignore everything else like their opinion on what's better. We all know they always side with anything that has an apple logo on it.

There was a very long period of time where Microsoft was also in this same boat and they, too, could do no wrong in the eyes of the media. Many superior competitive products and companies eventually failed because they did not carry the Microsoft logo. Well, now, the tables have simply turned and they're the ones facing uphill battles.

But we certainly do not have enough insight into Microsoft's R&D to know the exact product from which the Surface tablet descended. I've always felt that--unlike laptops and desktop PCs--it was necessary for Microsoft to create the Surface because Windows and the mobile devices market certainly do not share the same success and enthusiasm as Windows and the laptop/desktop devices market. As a result, by and large OEM products are not as varied and stellar as their laptops/desktop products, so who--but Microsoft--was going to showcase the new Windows without first waiting to see if the new Windows was going to be a market success? Microsoft certainly does not need to make laptops and desktops in order to prove and sustain Windows because the OEMs have that covered; not so, however, for the mobile/touch-based devices.

Unlike Apple, Microsoft's strategy is to extend Windows to the mobile/touch-based devices rather than create a separate OS; this is just one of those uphill battles that they are facing.

 

[JimE]

I'm currently using my new sp3 in bed while watching Netflix. I've moved the angle of the kickstand several times in the last few minutes. Windows 8.1 is as touch-friendly as I've ever known with this device. And I've used iOS and android before.

Then it occurred to me. Anyone here remember the original surface tabletop from 2007? Sure, it was in a few coffee shops, but overall it was a non-event.

MS lied to us in that they said the sp3 is 2 years in the making. It's not. This form factor, the way that people can use this device, etc. have been part of MS's plan all along. They just needed for the right technology to come along. That's why after they came out of the tabletop surface, they realized that it wasn't what they envisioned, so they renamed it and started working on something else.

You know how you've envisioned something, built it, and realized it didn't come out like you wanted? I think the original tabletop surface was like that and they'd been working on the surface and windows 8 ever since.

MS has to some degree been twisting the truth to everyone since the days they basically stole the CP/M code from Digital Research to create MS DOS, so anything they do should be suspect. Just think about all the quirky variations of Windows they have put out and then a few months later come out with another variation to sell everyone to replace the previous quirky mess.