New Apple 12" MacBook - competition to SP3 ?

[CrippsCorner]

Really hope they follow up with an XPS15...

 

[vsherry]

Really hope they follow up with an XPS15...

What do you mean? You hope they reduce the bezel on the XPS 15?

 

[eltos_lightfoot]

Listen, I like Apple, but that thing is an overpriced netbook. And I have lots of Apple gear. If the SP4 is innovative at all, it can really push Windows 10 forward. Apple for years has increasingly been ignoring the professional sector. It is somewhat understandable, as the iPhone is what makes the most money. However, I demand an actual computer instead of a netbook. The SP3 IS an actual computer.

And, yes, I typed this on an iPad. This Macbook "computer" is so innovative it sucks at being a computer.

 

[zhenya]

This is no netbook.

In some workloads, the Core-M 5y70 used in the base MacBook outclasses the i5 in the SP3.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8515/quick-look-at-core-m-5y70-and-llama-mountain

The reality is that the average student/business traveler/typical user has not been cpu-limited for many years now. They value lightweight designs that run cool and silent with good battery life over cpu power they don't really need. This MacBook is a reflection of this reality.

 

[GreyFox7]

the Core-M 5y70 used in the base MacBook

What evidence is there it has a 5Y70?

After further review I'm revising my earlier view, I think its possible the base model has a Core-M 5y31 CPU.
Base model 5Y31
Up model 5Y51

But to date nobody has demonstrated reliable, reproducible performance numbers close to the Intel Reference Platform which had a huge heat sink on the back.

 

[GreyFox7]

Here is a more recent comparison of a Core-M Helix 2 to its predecessor running a pre-Haswell i5 3337U CPU. It was slower on CPU specific tests although quicker on GPU tests.

http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/review/lenovo/thinkpad-helix-2/563567/.
(italics mine)

The first ThinkPad product (Helix 2) to make use of the Intel Core M CPU, and as we’ve already mentioned, it isn’t as fast overall as the original Helix, which featured an Intel Core i5 CPU (3337U).​

This was shown in our Blender 3D rendering test, in which the Helix 2 recorded a time of 1min (the original Helix got 45sec). That’s 1sec quicker than the Lenovo Yoga 3 Pro, (Note: Yoga 3 Pro performance lags well behind Llama Mountain) which uses the same Core M CPU model.​

Graphics processing was a little different, with the Helix 2 recording slightly better results in 3DMark’s mid-range Cloud Gate test (3418 compared to 2820). (remember this is not Haswell being compared it's Ivy Bridge with HD4000 graphics) It’s also better than the Yoga 3 Pro, though that tablet has a much higher screen resolution to drive (3200x1800 for the Yoga 3 compared to 1920x1080 for the Helix 2).​

Storage performance was a bit slower, with the 256GB solid state drive recording a sequential read speed of 430 megabytes per second (MBps) in CrystalDiskMark, and a write speed of 244MBps. While it had a different drive, the original Helix got results of 433MBps and 263MBps for reading and writing, respectively​

So another disappointing result comparing Core-Ms to i5Us. To be fair, the Core-M should not be compared to the i5U series as Core-M replaces the Y series, not the U series so that's where the comparison should be made. However, Intel opened this line of comparison and did so I think with cooked numbers. i.e. Llama Mountain with its non-production Laboratory grade Heat Sink.

Still looking for the Core-M Haswell U series killer... will the HP X2 (Nope, failed) 2015 MacBook do it??? Stay tuned and we will find out.

It appears that the Core-M does out pace the Apple A8X SoC so your Core-M device will still outperform any iPad.

 

[CrippsCorner]

What do you mean? You hope they reduce the bezel on the XPS 15?

Yes, as in the XPS13 is described as a 13" laptop in a 11" frame... a new XPS15 could be a 15" laptop in a 13" frame, perfect

 

[theveterans]

This is no netbook.

In some workloads, the Core-M 5y70 used in the base MacBook outclasses the i5 in the SP3.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/8515/quick-look-at-core-m-5y70-and-llama-mountain

The reality is that the average student/business traveler/typical user has not been cpu-limited for many years now. They value lightweight designs that run cool and silent with good battery life over cpu power they don't really need. This MacBook is a reflection of this reality.

Either SP3 is throttling or it's running too many background tasks. I do believe that they're equal in performance when both aren't throttling. Here's the bottomline: on everyday tasks such as office and web and quick benchmark, both non throttling Core M (top of the line) and non throttling i5 SP3 are equal. For extended CPU usage such as editing/converting videos, i5 > Core M due to TDP advantage.

 

[GreyFox7]

I do not think what Intel achieved with Llama Mountain will be achieved by a commercial product.

 

[theveterans]

I do not think what Intel achieved with Llama Mountain will be achieved by a commercial product.

Very rare for a manufacturer to configure the base frequency to max and the TDP to 6 watts. ASUS 2-in-1 tablet did though and it can certainly match a SP3 i5 in short length benchmarks which is perfectly fine for Tablet/light tasks usage.

 

[ptrkhh]

Well, a few things are innovative IMO:

1) trackpad that doesn't clic but vibrates instead;
2) keyboard;
3) disposition of the batteries;
4) miniaturization of the logicboard (which is very small - smaller than the Raspberry PI);

They all seem to be space-saving techniques which indeed sound like brilliant ideas, until you figure out that they all ended up in a slower, thicker and heavier product at the end of the day

About Core M chip, you can't really maintain all the 4300U power without a fan. IPC improvement from 22nm to 14nm couldn't really reduce the power consumption by THAT much. In fact, Core M uses capacitors to give it more power beyond its TDP for short burst power. That's what allows it to compete with 4300U in benches. So, objectively speaking its an Intel-approved throttling. If you want to keep anything more than 6W running for an extended time, you need a fan to cool it down somehow. You can't break the law of physics.

 

[theveterans]

Well very rare for people to do serious video editing of very long video clips so regardless of using Core M or i5 it won't matter much for 95% of tablet users IMO. I'm into maximizing performance from a very low voltage CPU (400 or lower MHz idle frequency) to save battery rather than having a ULV CPU at 800 MHz idle and consume more power for tablet use. ARM CPUs can stably clock at very low frequency which contributes to their ultra long connected standby states