What's new

Postponing Gratification....

Wait for a Broadwell surface ?


  • Total voters
    26

kundas1

Super Moderator
Staff member
^^ exactly people seem to think because there is a i5/i7 cpu under the hood then it can replace a desktop with a DEDICATED GPU or replace a laptop that has a DEDICATED GPU when in fact it can't and then blame the device for not being able to perform when it is the USER/BUYER that can't tell the difference between a device with a dedicated GPU to one that is ONBOARD... not even laptops that have onboard GPU can perform like a computer that has a nice dedicated GPU. and if you want a tablet that has a dedicated GPU then buy the RAZER EDGE tablet that has a dedicated GPU, but then again it wont be as thin and light as the SP3
 

GreyFox7

Super Moderator
Staff member
I think Microsoft made some good choices and while I love performance the more I look at the power performance tradeoffs I think they did good and there's also room to tweak what they have vs being maxed out if they went with the Y series i5 & i7.

They we wise to focus on the majority of users needs particularly on a short update cycle vs assuming SP2 users would upgrade they opened then Pro line up to a wider audience with the new form factor. For heavy work loads stick with SP2 but for most users SP3 is very good and will serve them well.
 

jollywombat

Member
Mix of general users lack of understanding about computers mixed with the advertising from MS showing this as a do-all machine. Entirely un-surprised about it, been this way for quite some time with various laptop releases and such, and even the IPAD which people buy thinking it will be an actual computer then realizing it is basically just a media consumption device.

The SP3 is a great machine, be it i5 or i7, and will be very fast assuming your not doing tasks on it better suited towards workstation requirements (rendering, extended calculations, gaming). Other than gaming, 99% of regular users would never experience a time when they are maxing the CPU out for a extended period of time to experience the throttling. Benchmarks are showing an artificially bad review of the device by putting it in the worst case scenario (as a benchmark is designed to do) to test the hardware. Im not defending MS here for not having a cooling solution/device design that can cope with extended sustained 100% workload, but at the same time, this is not a realistic scenario for the user-base. Just keep this in mind here when considering the negatives that people bring up.
 

mohcho

Active Member
wynand32, I would agree completely with your comments.

People want a single device that does it all, but for most people the SP3 meets that requirement. For those who have specialized needs for computing power, high end gaming and other specific use cases, the SP3 cannot meet those needs in the format that they have designed it in.

High CPU power = heat and there's no way to dissipate that kind of heat in something that is so thin without having massive fans which equal noise. The engineering of the SP3 is a feat unto itself right now and it may get thinner and lighter, but the specific use cases of the OP cannot be met by the SP3 at this point in time.
 

Len J

Active Member
I'll only speak for me. I have a Lenovo W520 i7 8gb. It does everything I need with MS office 365 small business premium and my photography w CC for photographers. I only have 3 needs unmet.

1.) weight. With charger, it's close to 7 lbs.
2.) better battery life. I get about 4.5 hours (which is why I need to carry charger)
3.) easier note taking. In an effort to go paperless, in a job that requires a ton of note taking, I've become a one-note maven. Unfortunately, I'm a terrible typist. The ability to use handwriting to capture searchable notes would be awesome. Now I write them and type up when I get home or type very slowly. Being able to come home and supplement the handwriting w typed thoughts would save me a ton of time.

It appears that an SP3 i7 may solve 2 out of 3 & maybe 3, if Lightroom didn't create a ton of throttling.

With the use of Office 365 SBP, & it's ability to mirror the office setup on multiple PC's, I'm exploring the option of using the current laptop as my office machine and a SP3 as my meeting/road machine. That would give me the ability to test it to it's limits to see where the boundaries are for my uses. Just trying to decide if the sunk cost in the worst case use would be worth it for me.

I'd love to just have one machine.

Ymmv

Len
 
OP
R

ramit

New Member
Perhaps Microsoft (or other mobile Haswelll ultrabook manufacturers) should change their specs from:

... Intel Core i5-4300U 2.90 GHz with Intel HD Graphics 4400 ...

to

... Intel Core i5-4300U 2.90 GHz with Intel HD Graphics 4400 * ** ...

* unless you are actually using it for more than 10 seconds in which case it will throttle down to your 5 years old laptop level performances.

** Dual core CPU but we don't really mean it, using both cores and the GPU at the same time will void our claims.

Imagine shopping for a brand new BMW just to be told that "yes, it pack a punch, sure you cannot use it but lets pretend you can and make you pay for it anyway"...

As many of you said, the future we really want is not there yet, but I find Intel's claims about Haswell to be borderline deceptive this time around.
 

be77solo

Active Member
Wait for Broadwell if you aren't in a need to buy situation and care about performance, it will only improve things!

Unfortunately, I sold my SP2 (which I loved and performed magnitudes better at heavy lifting compared to even the i7 SP3) to pay for the SP3 as I never expected the performance deficit... I figured same CPU, and Microsoft is preaching a faster better machine, so was blindsided by the throttling.

You seem to know the deal. If I were you, I'd wait to see what Broadwell brings.

I honestly feel like the SP3 is in the exact same boat the SP1 (Ivy Bridge) was in... in desperate need of a CPU architecture update. Hopefully SP4 will be to the SP3 that the SP2 was to the SP1...

Others will of course argue the other side of the coin, but if they are honest with themselves, they'd also be just fine with a Bay Trail device because once the SP3 is throttled to ~800mhz on the CPU and ~400-600mhz on the GPU, it's a pig.

And no, this isn't compared to a desktop or even a laptop.... but simply to the SP2 it was designed to replace.
 
OP
R

ramit

New Member
...Bay Trail device because once the SP3 is throttled to ~800mhz on the CPU and ~400-600mhz on the GPU, it's a pig...
Interestingly enough, At work, we tried pushing a simulation 2 ragdolls and 10 crates on a dell venue 8 pro, the thing got hotter and hotter and simply froze after few minutes, we had to disable multi-threading to get the thing stable, quad-core they say ? laughable.

On (mobile) Haswell, we do not get freezing but when one's game frame-rate drops below 20 fps, we could as well (pun intended) call it frozen for any practical purpose.

So yes, I will wait for Broadwell surface and reassess then, But damn that SP3 looked nice!
 

megatronium

Active Member
Please guys wait for Broadwell and quit poisoning this site. We get it: the SP3 isn't for you. Let the ones it is for discuss it and be happy. There are plenty of posts by most of you who are voicing your displeasure for us to see. It's really making me dislike this forum and I used to love it. Find a better way to spend your time. Go get the Razer Edge Pro or something similar and enjoy its benefits and limitations.
 
OP
R

ramit

New Member
Please guys wait for Broadwell and quit poisoning this site. We get it: the SP3 isn't for you. Let the ones it is for discuss it and be happy. There are plenty of posts by most of you who are voicing your displeasure for us to see. It's really making me dislike this forum and I used to love it. Find a better way to spend your time. Go get the Razer Edge Pro or something similar and enjoy its benefits and limitations.
Is this really what you want ? only positive and uplifting feedback / discussions about the SP3 ? I think not.

I understand the emotional investment that one has with a brand new machine, but this do not mandate censoring speech, If we where to apply what your are requesting, this forum would be devoid of all value for those of us that did not yet bought or pre-order the SP3, this would, in a very real sens, make this forum less valuable not more.

This is human nature, i.e. "I'm proud to be a citizen of the country X..... because I just happen to be born there..." , but keeping this type of response in check is important for so much more than just computers.

Embrace all discussions, none of them makes your SP3 any-less great.
 

megatronium

Active Member
No one said anything about wanting only positive or uplifting feedback or discussions. My points are as follows:

1. The same people are running from thread to thread posting the same things cluttering a site with variations of the same opinion. We get it: the SP3 isn't for you.

2. You are free to continue to voice your opinion: it doesn't mean I have to enjoy it or agree with it. vice/versa

3. If you don't like the SP3 so much, why continue to post here under the guise of "informing people"? Like I said earlier, it would seem you have something better to do like visiting a forum that has a product you actually like unless you don't.

4. Some expected too much, made an ill-informed decision, and seem bitter. It's making ME enjoy this site less. That's just MY opinion which I'm also free to voice. I'm sure I'm not alone in my opinion just like you aren't alone in yours. Constructive criticism is one thing, but it's getting a bit ridiculous that the same people are posting the same things but continue to frequent this site.

Carry on. I'll just wait it out or visit less often.
 
Search tags for this page

broadwell surface

postponing gratification

Members online

Top