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Windows 10 problems on suface pro 3

Pedrom

Member
During the TP touch was always lagging behind the desktop development. It'll get there eventually. This OS is not supposed to be complete out of the box. They've released it in a state they are happy with, and then will update and add to it as time goes on.

@Pedrom You can rearrange tabs, you just drag it just as you would expect you would.

I agree on the action centre though. Way too big and doesn't do much. I couldn't really care about notifications, I only use it for the settings buttons. However for me the argument goes both ways, in that because I find no use for it, the size doesn't really bother me because it's never open. The action centre is not designed to be something open on the side though, so does it matter how much space it takes up? You're supposed to open it, attend to whatever actions windows would like you to attend to (clear all :p) and then close it again.

In touch mode, you can't rearrange the tabs in Edge. At least I can't anyway. Works fine with a mouse.
Touch. Touch. Touch!
And my main gripe with the size of the Notification Centre is because of accidental launch. If I'm scrolling through a page with my thumb close to the right edge, then sometimes I accidentally catch the bezel and it opens. In 8.1, this wasn't a problem because it was so thin, when I tried scrolling again, it went away. This time, because it's so big, I have to close the Centre by touching somewhere else on the screen or swiping. It doesn't sound major, but it's really disruptive and annoying!

You say that during the TP the touch aspect was a little behind. Why do you make it sound like that's ok? Touch in 8.1 was damn near perfect for me. And that's my point. For touch devices, Windows 10 is a step back. For desktops, the leap from 7 to 10 is welcome, but not overly huge.

Too soon, MS. Too soon.
It's as if they saw no one liked 8.1 on desktop, had to 'innovate' to justify a new version which made it better again, and then launched it quickly - forgetting why they made 8 in the first place...for touch!
 

hughlle

Super Moderator
Staff member
In touch mode, you can't rearrange the tabs in Edge. At least I can't anyway. Works fine with a mouse.
Touch. Touch. Touch!
And my main gripe with the size of the Notification Centre is because of accidental launch. If I'm scrolling through a page with my thumb close to the right edge, then sometimes I accidentally catch the bezel and it opens. In 8.1, this wasn't a problem because it was so thin, when I tried scrolling again, it went away. This time, because it's so big, I have to close the Centre by touching somewhere else on the screen or swiping. It doesn't sound major, but it's really disruptive and annoying!

You say that during the TP the touch aspect was a little behind. Why do you make it sound like that's ok? Touch in 8.1 was damn near perfect for me. And that's my point. For touch devices, Windows 10 is a step back. For desktops, the leap from 7 to 10 is welcome, but not overly huge.

Too soon, MS. Too soon.
It's as if they saw no one liked 8.1 on desktop, had to 'innovate' to justify a new version which made it better again, and then launched it quickly - forgetting why they made 8 in the first place...for touch!

I am not excusing touch being behind, i'm simply pointing out that during the TP, Microsoft for whatever reason they chose, appeared to focus on the desktop development before tablet mode development. Possibly because the vast majority of it's user base is not on a touch system, who knows.

You say it is too soon, but I've been on win 10 for a long time now, long enough that I have very happily adapted to it vs 8.1 and would never go back to 8.1 despite the rough nature of this release. Personally I love tablet mode on win 10 far more than the tablet experience on 8.1. It's all personal preference.

As to moving tabs, i'm sat here doing just that in tablet mode on edge using my finger. You just have to hold down for half a second before you drag.

These surfaces are my first windows tablets, and the first thing I learnt was how annoying I found having the taskbar on the bottom as it normally is. I find everything much easier with it positioned at the top and I much prefer it this way now. It's all simply a case of readjusting. If I accidentally scroll on my phone in the wrong manner it opens the android notification panel, but this isn't a fault of androids, I simply used it wrong.
 

Pedrom

Member
I am not excusing touch being behind, i'm simply pointing out that during the TP, Microsoft for whatever reason they chose, appeared to focus on the desktop development before tablet mode development. Possibly because the vast majority of it's user base is not on a touch system, who knows.

You say it is too soon, but I've been on win 10 for a long time now, long enough that I have very happily adapted to it vs 8.1 and would never go back to 8.1 despite the rough nature of this release. Personally I love tablet mode on win 10 far more than the tablet experience on 8.1. It's all personal preference.

As to moving tabs, i'm sat here doing just that in tablet mode on edge using my finger. You just have to hold down for half a second before you drag.

These surfaces are my first windows tablets, and the first thing I learnt was how annoying I found having the taskbar on the bottom as it normally is. I find everything much easier with it positioned at the top and I much prefer it this way now. It's all simply a case of readjusting. If I accidentally scroll on my phone in the wrong manner it opens the android notification panel, but this isn't a fault of androids, I simply used it wrong.

Ah yes, I didn't know you had to hold it down for a bit before moving, thanks.

And you wouldn't have that problem on a Windows Phone you know ;)
But even then, the software should be optimised for the user, not the other way around. When it comes to UX, you shouldn't be able to be "simply using it wrong". That's just bad design.
 

hughlle

Super Moderator
Staff member
Ah yes, I didn't know you had to hold it down for a bit before moving, thanks.

And you wouldn't have that problem on a Windows Phone you know ;)
But even then, the software should be optimised for the user, not the other way around. When it comes to UX, you shouldn't be able to be "simply using it wrong". That's just bad design.

It's not bad design. It's compromise. By the argument of not being able to simply use it wrong, then they should get rid of the taskbar, because I can accidentally launch a program or minimize my browser if I started scrolling up from the wrong place. Maybe taskbar should only be accessible from a 3 finger swipe, then it would not create this problem, but then you'd complain that it shouldn't take that much effort to access the taskbar.

And i'm waiting to see what microsofts new offerings are :) But this is almost the main issue here. I'd be coming from a different OS, so what I was used to, or used to avoiding, suddenly changes, and i'd possibly find different problems with windows phone. You are experiencing the problem with the notification centre because you are still using the device as if it were 8.1. it is not 8.1. You can't just expect to jump on a new OS and have everything work the same without any requirement for you to adjust and change some habits. It's not 8.1, scrolling like that clearly isn't viable for you, so why not just change? Windows isn't, because Microsoft believe that they have made the suitable compromise (which could be argued in that you're the first person I have come across complaining about this issue)

Both the OS and user are responsible for a good user experience. Design is always about compromise. You can never make everyone happy, that is just life.
 
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Pedrom

Member
It's not bad design. It's compromise. By the argument of not being able to simply use it wrong, then they should get rid of the taskbar, because I can accidentally launch a program or minimize my browser if I started scrolling up from the wrong place. Maybe taskbar should only be accessible from a 3 finger swipe, then it would not create this problem, but then you'd complain that it shouldn't take that much effort to access the taskbar.

And i'm waiting to see what microsofts new offerings are :) But this is almost the main issue here. I'd be coming from a different OS, so what I was used to, or used to avoiding, suddenly changes, and i'd possibly find different problems with windows phone. You are experiencing the problem with the notification centre because you are still using the device as if it were 8.1. it is not 8.1. You can't just expect to jump on a new OS and have everything work the same without any requirement for you to adjust and change some habits. It's not 8.1, scrolling like that clearly isn't viable for you, so why not just change? Windows isn't, because Microsoft believe that they have made the suitable compromise (which could be argued in that you're the first person I have come across complaining about this issue)

Both the OS and user are responsible for a good user experience. Design is always about compromise. You can never make everyone happy, that is just life.

No, not at all. I've not said once that it's a transition issue. Nor am I using it like 8.1.
The majority of the issues I'm finding are either bugs or just thoughtless design.
I didn't get my first blue screen in 10 by using it wrong... it just happened when I pressed the power button. Neither is it my fault that the windows don't resize properly in touch mode. Or the on screen keyboard pops up when it feels like it. Or that good functions have just disappeared with no reason. Or that my emails wouldn't send in Outlook...
It's not transition. I'm perfectly capable of that. That's why I loved 8.1 over 7 (and now 10). I'm merely providing feedback on issues I've faced.
But thanks for your help on organising tabs in Edge. It's worth noting though that the delay shouldn't be there. It's not there on other parts of the UI, like moving apps on the taskbar, or dragging whole windows. It's inconsistent UX that I really don't like!
Let's hope they don't break Windows for phones...
 

hughlle

Super Moderator
Staff member
I can understand and appreciate that. Those are genuine issues. My post was aimed solely at the point about the notification centre. That is not a design fault, it is just a compromise. But again, this is an OS that is designed to evolve over time, so if in a few months time they have received enough feedback (if you don't like something, open the feedback app and tell them) then it is entirely possible that it may be changed in the future to offer more options.

Any problems or suggestions, get onto the feedback app and let them know :) Through the course of the TP, it was very apparent that MS were actually reading the feedback and changing things based on users demands, if viable. This hasn't stopped with the official release. Microsoft are making a much stronger effort this time around to make the user happy, not just tell them to put up or shut up like with windows 8, forcing users to use 3rd party workarounds. Windows 10 is initially going to be a game of patience.

With regard to UI inconsistency, i'm going to be optimistic and think that maybe you have to hold and then drag because they've already reserved instant dragging for a feature they've yet to implement (such as swiping back and forward, or being able to swipe along the tab bar to switch tabs etc). Fingers crossed :) It's early days, i'm staying optimistic :)
 

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