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The Inexplicable Choices of MS...

Nuspieds

Active Member
It is what it is for now and MS seems to be avoiding folders for whatever reason :(
Yes, I think that someone on the design team equated folders with Desktop, and since Desktop is on the way out, then so must be folders! :)

Seriously, this has to be addressed because it is not a Desktop issue; it is an organization issue. Specifically with IE, you should see my Favorites folder structure; I have all my sites neatly and systematically organized. There are some Favorites that I infrequently use, so I couldn't even tell you the site name, but I know where to look in my Favorites folder structure to find them.

How can I do that with the Modern UI IE? Scroll through the ridiculously long list all my Favorites? And I don't know how that list is sorted, but it certainly isn't even alphabetical, though it appears so at first.

They can call it something else that is consistent with the Modern UI, but please implement folder functionality.
 

J515OP

Super Moderator
MS: Customer Support how may I help you?

Nuspieds: There are some Favorites that I infrequently use, so I couldn't even tell you the site name, but I know where to look in my Favotires folder to find them. How can I do that with the Modern UI IE?

MS: Well if you can't tell me the site name they are clearly not your favorites. Thank you for calling Customer Support, goodbye.


:cool2:
 

Nuspieds

Active Member
MS: Customer Support how may I help you?

Nuspieds: There are some Favorites that I infrequently use, so I couldn't even tell you the site name, but I know where to look in my Favotires folder to find them. How can I do that with the Modern UI IE?

MS: Well if you can't tell me the site name they are clearly not your favorites. Thank you for calling Customer Support, goodbye.


:cool2:
First of all, MS, you are the one who called that list "Favorites," not me!

Back in the original browser days--i.e., Netscape Navigator!--they were called Bookmarks, so there!!!

:LOL:
 

machistmo

Active Member
I would also like folders but have you zoomed all the way out? This essentially gives you folders.

View attachment 581

You are absolutely right, but am I the only thinking that Windows 8 came completely unfinished? I mean if METRO is it, why is it SO BAD? The Metro Control Panel is half done, I still use the DESKTOP Control panel for everything I do there except maybe pairing a device or choosing a printer. The file management doesn't really exist in Metro. All the basic stuff one would expect in a touch OS is just NOT THERE with Metro. I for one like the desktop and wish they would modify it to fit touch rather continue down this METRO path.... Just my 2 cents.

The whole OS seems a bit schizophrenic to me.. On one hand they SHOVE METRO in your face but make creating accounts and using metro in the enterprise rocket science at best. I feel like MS suddenly accepted that Apple was eating their lunch and decided to ditch the enterprise market for the iTunes model... and there is a Microsoft shaped hole in the wall where they went rushing off trying to copy Apples model.. now we have this half assed OS with an App-store that is, let's just be honest here, MEH at best and an OS that is NOT enterprise friendly either.
 
OP
mitchellvii

mitchellvii

Well-Known Member
Well technically it is Modern UI not Metro. Nevertheless, Modern UI is a lot like dating a Gemini girl. On the one hand you enjoy her adventurous, playful nature. On the other hand she is constantly doing things that remind you she may not be playing with a full deck. If they wanted Modern UI to be everything they should have made it everything but they left things out that force us back to the desktop.

MS has always designed software by committee. The end product rarely feels like a cohesive unit but rather something developed in separate information silos then pasted together at the end. This has always been very obvious in Office where the way you code things in Access for instance is completely different than how you do the same thing in Word. In many ways Windows 8 is like that. That's why it doesn't feel intuitive and seems to have so many dead ends. You expect the next logical step but it isn't there.

MS's central planning for software development sucks and always has.
 
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machistmo

Active Member
The most frustrating part is that some of these design choices (like making favorites in Metro IE completely useless), survived countless meetings, reviews and planning sessions. Did they focus group a bunch of people who said Favorites should be a jumbled mess?

I can see it now. Hey Bob hows it coming on Metro IE? It's all done Bill. The guy that was supposed to make Favorites usable is out with the flu but nobody uses Favorites anyway so we're all good...

They lure people to those meetings with good food and drink, after that they agree to anything so that they will be invited to the next meeting and get that good food. Its a corporate game. The more you want people to green light a project, the more you spend on the goodies you offer at that meeting. Corporate project approval 101.
 

machistmo

Active Member
Well technically it is Modern UI not Metro. Nevertheless, Modern UI is a lot like dating a Gemini girl. On the one hand you enjoy her adventurous, playful nature. On the other hand she is constantly doing things that remind you she may not be playing with a full deck. If they wanted Modern UI to be everything they should have made it everything but they left things out that force us back to the desktop.

MS has always designed software by committee. The end product rarely feels like a cohesive unit but rather something developed in separate information silos then pasted together at the end. This has always been very obvious in Office where the way you code things in Access for instance is completely different than how you do the same thing in Word. In many way Windows 8 is like that. That's why it doesn't feel intuitive and seems to have so many dead ends. You expect the next logical step but it isn't there.

MS's central planning for software development sucks and always has.

Surely you're not suggesting this strategy lead to the GORGEOUS WINDOWS VISTA ???? Design OS, tell hardware manufacturers the details after the OS is live and being delivered? Sound familiar? No! I must be talking about some other company!
 
OP
mitchellvii

mitchellvii

Well-Known Member
The problem with communication in the typical organization is that the rank and file kisses ass to keep their jobs and then management believes the rank and file agree with all of their decisions. Then when those decisions fail, senior management blames middle management because they obviously failed implementing the wonderful strategy everyone believed was a great idea - the thought that the original idea was dumb to begin with is never considered.

Where is Tom Hanks sitting in the Board Meeting saying, "I don't get it?".

[video=youtube;oHF_hYi-5vI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHF_hYi-5vI[/video]

This is why companies like Apple suffer so badly when they lose one visionary at the top. The fish truly stinks from the head down. Unless leadership happens to get it right, the organization won't fix it because it is defensive by nature.

I assure you there have been choices made by MS in the development of Windows 8 and the Surface that engineers and marketing people in middle management thought were idiotic, but no one wanted to be the canary in the coal mine. Unfortunately, it is these very middle management people who are interacting with the public on a daily basis and KNOW what they want. Meanwhile senior management who is making the strategic choices are too far removed from public reaction and tend to be idealistic, seeing themselves as visionaries instead of listening to what the public is telling them. So you have the people with biggest egos and lowest information steering the ship. This is how vessels like the Titanic hit icebergs in the middle of big oceans.

It is not surprising then that a company full of intelligent people like MS makes such boneheaded, tone-deaf choices. I mean, this is the guy calling the tune and everyone else is just trying to dance:

steve-ballmer-ceo-of-microsoft.jpg

P.S., Never trust a man who doesn't brush his tongue.
 
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J515OP

Super Moderator
And what about the possibility that a lot of what Windows 8 and the Surface are, is exactly what the people want? After all most everybody here did get a Surface and has upgraded other machines to Windows 8. For the majority here these aren't our first tablets and the upgrades were from Windows 7. How do you explain all that? We were all brain washed by Microsoft's excellent advertising? :) Maybe we couldn't resist the single angle kickstand, overpriced keyboards and were willing to tolerate Windows 8 and its lack of a Start button just for those other features ;)
 
OP
mitchellvii

mitchellvii

Well-Known Member
And what about the possibility that a lot of what Windows 8 and the Surface are, is exactly what the people want? After all most everybody here did get a Surface and has upgraded other machines to Windows 8. For the majority here these aren't our first tablets and the upgrades were from Windows 7. How do you explain all that? We were all brain washed by Microsoft's excellent advertising? :) Maybe we couldn't resist the single angle kickstand, overpriced keyboards and were willing to tolerate Windows 8 and its lack of a Start button just for those other features ;)

I would hardly call the few respondents to this forum as representative of the marketplace who chose NOT to buy Windows 8 or Surface Pro.

Some people, like myself, purchased the SP as a stop gap. I needed a tablet that could run full OneNote and Office with inking now and this was the best athlete in the draft at this price point at the moment. That doesn't mean it will be my starting quarterback next season. As a matter of fact, once Haswell is out I will be surprised if I go Surface again. I need more of an ultrabook that can be a tablet than a tablet that can be an ultrabook. I promise you I won't be buying a Haswell with less than an 11.6 inch screen.
 

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