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I give up - Surface Pro is going back

J515OP

Super Moderator
I work in Network Support and handle upwards of 200 calls per month. I used the Surface primarily for remote support. That would have made the 5th time since getting the device that I needed to completely wipe it and restage the Device. Since they are new and its a personal device, I have no image for it or time to devote to creating one, meaning each time this happens I have to reset the device (30 + Minutes) go into the office to re-hang it on the domain (45 minute drive on a weekend) install the software tools I need (2 + hours for the most basic stuff). Enough already. I spend my days making other peoples stuff work, I just don't have the time to devote to keeping this device working for me.
I understand you are frustrated but I simply can't understand this. You are an IT professional and you have no time for making an image? Yet by your own calculations you have spent 3:15+ hours 5 times already for a total of 15:45+ but you can't find time to make a back up image? Maybe this isn't the device for you but you certainly didn't do yourself any favors either.
 
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machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
I understand you are frustrated but I simply can't understand this. You are an IT professional and you have no time for making an image? Yet by your own calculations you have spent 3:15+ hours 5 times already for a total of 15:45+ but you can't find time to make a back up image? Maybe this isn't the device for you but you certainly didn't do yourself any favors either.
My company does not allow me unrestricted access to the servers and or storage or the time to devote to such a project. Each project must be approved and time must be granted for this to happen on the clock. I have been using the device for work because it was lightweight and easy to carry around. The TPT2 is lightweight, a pilot program device within our company and it still has no image. I barely have enough time in the day to get all my work done. What is it you don't understand?

I could make room for a snapshot but nothing more. Even that would require me to be without the device until I got back on site. My old ghost server here at home died recently and I swore off working 70 hours a week when I took a job almost 1 hour commute each way. Besides all that, our allowable OT is 5 hours per week. I have to figure out how to get the work done in that time frame. Its impossible to devote any time to a true ZTI image when I am pulled in 14 directions each day. I get to work at 6am to have enough time to finish documentation and work for the projects I have in the fire now, before everyone arrives at 8am and my crazy day starts in earnest. Its WORK and a four letter word.

Its unacceptable to me that this device requires so many hard resets. Sorry. I just cant stomach another one. It was a fun thing for a while but it is just too unstable to warrant the cost and time investment.
 
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OP
machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
Machistmo - Just out of curiously, did you upgrade your HD4000 driver from the Intel's website? The last round of Windows Updates had a modified Video Driver as well. Before cashing in, roll back the driver.
I installed the updates Microsoft offered. I believe the display driver was in there. I don't know however as the device has been RESET and is in a box. I have just had enough, I should not have to expend this much energy to keep the device functional, its just not worth it.
 
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machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
I spent a lot of time making this contract job a full time Gig back in December and I simply needed a solid portable tool to have around in the case of the after hour support call. I have worked VERY hard to establish myself in my current role with my company and don't need this device being a pain in my ass. Its just that simple.
 

malberttoo

Well-Known Member
I understand you are frustrated but I simply can't understand this. You are an IT professional and you have no time for making an image? Yet by your own calculations you have spent 3:15+ hours 5 times already for a total of 15:45+ but you can't find time to make a back up image? Maybe this isn't the device for you but you certainly didn't do yourself any favors either.
I agree with this sentiment. Not to hate on your party machistmo, but it took me about 20 minutes to make the image of my S-pro, with True Image, once I got everything the way I wanted it. As a mission-critical device to you, can't see how there was wasn't time for it. Just saying.... :big smile:
 
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machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
20 minutes really? Really? Honestly? Not to rain on yours but this device is a Joke. It just isn't ready for prime-time, from the bleed in around the edges it feels rushed. I have used Acronis and my experience is that the results are bad at best. Tired of the need for this being EVERY Patch Tuesday. I mean yea, I expected more.
 
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machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
I agree with this sentiment. Not to hate on your party machistmo, but it took me about 20 minutes to make the image of my S-pro, with True Image, once I got everything the way I wanted it. As a mission-critical device to you, can't see how there was wasn't time for it. Just saying.... :big smile:
Every single patch Tuesday has resulted in this being my only recourse. Every single one. Acronis sucks. I prefer a fresh reload to the wonky behavior I have seen with this util. I have attempted to use this and other methods and spent more time getting crap results than it has been worth. I am sorry Im not a fanboi- Just saying :big smile:
 
OP
machistmo

machistmo

Active Member
Maybe it was all my fault for expecting this thing to work for more than 3 weeks at a time.... I mean honestly I am so busy, I needed a more stable device and have no desire to use Acronis or anything else to rebuild my device every single time a patch drops. Again, its all me, not that this unit has been a complete failure in promise or practice. No it has. I currently have 700 units in the field that need to be imaged or replaced with new Windows 7 images in 10 months, sorry if I am not wonder boy and prefer to date once in a while. Not to mention the Corporate office that I support.

Blame the user, but honestly, in my experience the Pro device has been a complete waste of time and energy. Maybe not totally, but for the most part. When I flashed this Lenovo tablet it gave me a small TEXT indicator of progress, not a line that simply said PLEASE WAIT WHILE WE INSTALL A SYSTEM UPDATE, that NEVER progresses. I mean, I cant make this stuff up. I waited four hours yesterday afternoon for it to finish, worked in the yard, cleaned the patio, planted veggies, cut the grass, cleaned out the garage and helped my neighbor install a garage door opener, came back to find THE SAME screen. I expect this stuff, but have had enough, yep.
 
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Nuspieds

Active Member
I have a W510 Laptop for home use, but it was just so big and Bulky, I liked the Surface being so portable and powerful. I just cannot be expected to reset the device every time MS releases firmware or a patch that doesn't install correctly. I must say I was SHOCKED at the level of incompetence displayed by the first tech I spoke with yesterday morning. I rarely call for support for anything and expect the guy on the other end to be trained to at least some degree. He was Googling the System Aggregator Firmware issue and reading me steps I already had on my screen. He even admitted he didn't know what it was at first.
I went from a ThinkPad W700 to the SP. In comparison, that W700 was like 4 SPs, 2 side-by-side! :)

Shocked, were you? I wasn't. It's not just MS; even in the corporate world, Help Desks are very quick to reimage the PC rather than troubleshoot.

Weekly, I take my own system image backups so it is easy for me to fall back to a working/stable installation if I mess something up. On my last support chat with MS regarding the issue with the Trackpad Settings app being broken after the firmware update, the Answer Tech was trying to get me to do a refresh! I'm not the average IT consumer, so I knew better than to follow her instructions! But how ridiculous to tell someone to do that, especially since a refresh would not have solved the problem. On the chat, of course I refused and I asked the Answer Tech to try her Trackpad Settings app. Sure enough, she saw the problem. See? She didn't even troubleshoot by trying it out on her SP; rather, it was simpler to just suggest a refresh, as if I have nothing else to do with my time but reinstall and reconfigure my apps.

I called her out on it, too! I told her, "See, refresh would not have solved the problem and, therefore, that was the wrong solution to propose without first doing some detailed and basic troubleshooting."
 

Nuspieds

Active Member
20 minutes really? Really? Honestly? Not to rain on yours but this device is a Joke. It just isn't ready for prime-time, from the bleed in around the edges it feels rushed. I have used Acronis and my experience is that the results are bad at best. Tired of the need for this being EVERY Patch Tuesday. I mean yea, I expected more.
Of course, backup duration varies depending on type of backup, volume of data, etc., but I backup both my SP hard disk and the MicroSD card, maximum compression, with verification afterwards and I'm done in an hour (cut out the verification process and I'm done in about 1/2 hour).

Whether I use a Surface or some other device as my main Windows device, you can rest assured that I will have a system backup and restore procedure in place. Never mind the Surface itself; in the Windows world we all know the downsides of such an open platform: Incompatibility nightmares! Especially in the Windows environment, it has always been best practice to have a fallback image because all it takes is one software installation to completely destabilize your system. This isn't unique to the Surface; it's just the norm in Windows.
 

malberttoo

Well-Known Member
20 minutes really? Really? Honestly? Not to rain on yours but this device is a Joke. It just isn't ready for prime-time, from the bleed in around the edges it feels rushed. I have used Acronis and my experience is that the results are bad at best. Tired of the need for this being EVERY Patch Tuesday. I mean yea, I expected more.
In this case, I completely disagree with your statement. You can't make a blanket statement like "it just isn't ready for prime-time", indicating the entire Surface Pro line as a whole, when in fact there are thousands that are being used, and operating properly. Absolutely, YOURS isn't ready, and of course, and there may be issues with the Surface Pro in general, but they are the kinds of issues that are common to 1-st gen devices. My very first Pro, out of the box, had a defective WiFi card. I've been a first adopter for a LOT of gadgets, and this is a pretty low level of issues, IMHO. They dropped the ball on the Wacom pressure sensitivity drivers, but other than that, it looks like every other device like it.

It's unfortunate that every time a patch comes out, it wrecks your machine, but again, from this very forum it's evident that for every person that has that issue, there are scores of others whose Pros are working fine.

20-ish minutes is accurate for the time to make my image. I didn't time it, just kicked it off and came back to it later, definitely 30 minutes or less. Like Nuspieds indicated, I didn't do a verification pass afterward, and it was just the base OS, plus Office 2010, and a few utilities. The image doesn't actually write empty space of course, so the image size wasn't huge. So I'm not sure what your disbelief is, but my disbelief is that you reinstalled the OS that many times.

My first experience with an imaging app was Symantec's offering, Ghost, which I did not like. The next thing I tried was True Image, and have been using it for about 8 years. I'm not sure what your issue was with it, but I've used multiple versions of it to make hundreds of images. Of those, at least 7 or 8 times my bacon was completely saved by having those images, and never had an issue with any of them. Besides, their feature of being able to take an image, and restore the image to completely different hardware, is just plain cool.

Anyways, my statement in my initial post remains- I hope you do have better success with your next device.
 
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